There has recently been a question on Earth batteries on the Free energy newsgroup as so many were unaware of the existence of such a device and must admit that I was ignorant of the device myself until I came across this patent and so I reproduce an except from the patent application below.
"The object of my invention is to produce a current of electricity from an earth battery or batteries capable of generating a constant current of considerable intensity to be used for lightning rod and other purposes where voltaic batteries using solutions are now applied.
It is known that if different elements-for instance sheets of zinc and copper-be buried or placed in the earth ,a current of electricity is generated; but I have discovered that if such elements be partly embedded in sulphur so that the dampness of the earth may act in conjunction with the sulphur on the metals, a more intense will be created.
I utilise this in the following way: The current is collected by insulated wires coiled around nickel plated steel magnets ,which are planted north and south in the earth to receive the magnetic current of the earth; a secondary coil or coils of insulated wire surrounds the coil or coils around the magnets and receives by induction, electricity from both the voltaic and magneto-electro batteries.
In the drawing, the voltaic battery is composed of several pieces or plates of chemically pure zinc B, and the same number of copper, A they are embedded in a cake of sulphur C and are connected by a large insulated wire D, which being the primary coil between dissimilar elements is extended, without insulation to the base of the sulphur cake C, and also in a spiral coil or coils around steel magnets E, which are pointed magnetised and nickel plated.
These batteries are planted in the earth north and south, to receive the earths current of electricity according to the magnetic poles.
The primary coil or coils D are surrounded by secondary insulated wire F, in a spiral coil or coil to receive by induction ,electricity from the batteries current through D
end of patent extract
For those that are interested I recommend you getting a copy of the Borderlands Journal issue volume L111 number one first quarter 1997.
Where there is an interesting article giving more details are other related research into this interesting field..
In the article it is suggested that if you want to try the idea of earth batteries for yourself
If you want to try it then get two copper rods or pipe and drive them into the ground and then connect a galvanometer(place them near a tree for better results.) apparently the needle always points positive although it may take time for the current and voltage to build up.
It seems that early engineers and telegraph operators knew of the effects of these ground currents when their Edison batteries they had used went flat and long time depleted and their telegraph kept giving out sparks sometimes of greater intensity than when they had been using batteries.
Electrical Battery by
NATHAN B.STUBBLEFIELD OF MURRAY KENTUCKY
The following is a reproduction of Nathan B. Subblefield Patent the drawing may be inaccurate due to some difficulty in reading of the patent drawings ( Geoff )
ASSIGNOR OF ONE HALF TO WILLIAM G.LOVE OF SAME PLACE
Specification forming part of letters patent no 600,457 dated march 9 1898
Application filed October 24,1896 serial number 609969 no model
To all whom it may concern.
Be it known that I Nathan B Stubblefield a citizen of the United states of America, residing at Murray in the county of Calloway and
[ 5]
State of Kentucky have invented a new and useful Electrical Battery of which the following is a specification.
This invention relates to electrical batteries and it has for its objects to provide a
[10]
novel and practical battery for generating electrical currents of sufficient force for practical use, and also providing means for generating not only a constant primary current but also an induced momentary secondary
[15]
current. it is well know that if any voltaic couple be immersed in water placed in moist earth the positive element of the couple will undergo a galvanic action of sufficient intensity
[20]
to produce current when the terminals of the couple are bought in contact , and this form of battery is commonly as the "water Battery ", usually employed for charging electrometers , but are not capable of giving
[25]
any considerable current owing to their great internal resistance . Now the principle involved in this class of batteries is utilised to some extent in carrying out the present invention , but I contemplate, in connection
[30]
with water or moisture as the electrolyte ,t he use of a novel voltaic couple constructed in such a manner as to greatly multiply or increase the electrical output of ordinary voltaic cells , while at the same time producing in
[35]
operation a magnetic field having a sufficiently strong inductive effect to induce a current in a solenoid or secondary coil..To this end the invention contemplates a form of voltaic battery having a magnetic.
[40]
[45]
producing a current of practically constant electromotive force and being practically free of the rapid polarization common in all galvanic or voltaic batteries . With these and many other objects in view
[50]
the invention ,combination , arrangement of arts herein after more fully described, illustrated and claimed.
In the drawings Figure 1 is a side elevation of an electrical battery constructed in
[ 55]
accordance with this invention . Fig 2 is a central longitudinal sectional view of the battery , showing the same immersed in water as the electrolyte. Fig 3 is an enlarged sectional view of a portion of the battery ,showing
[60]
more clearly the manner of winding the voltaic couple or in other words , the wires comprising the couple . Fig 4 is a vertical sectional view of the battery , shown modified for use with an induction-coil.
[65]
referring to the accompanying drawings the numeral 1 designates a soft-iron core-piece extending longitudinally of the entire battery and preferably in the form of a bolt having at one end a nut 2 which permits of
[70]
the parts of the battery being readily assembled together and also quite readily taken apart for the purpose of repair , as will be readily understood. The central longitudinally-arranged core-piece 1 of the battery has
[ 75]
removably fitted on the opposite ends thereof the oppositely - located end heads 3,confining there between the magnetic coil-body 4 of the battery , said heads 3 being of wood or equivalent material. The coil -body 4 of the battery
[80]
is compactly formed by closely-wound coils of a copper and iron wire 5 and 6 ,respectively ,which wires form the electrodes of the voltaic couple , and while necessarily insulated from each other ,so as to have no metallic
[85]
contact ,are preferably wound in the manner clearly illustrated in fig 3 of the drawings.
In the preferred winding of the wires 5 and 6 copper wire 5 is incased in an insulating covering 7,while the iron wire 6
[90]
is a bare or naked wire ,so as to be more exposed to the action of the electrolyte and at the same time to intensify the magnetic field that is created and maintained within and around the coil-body 4 when the battery is in operation
[ 95]
and producing an electrical current . While the iron wire is preferably bare or naked for the reasons stated , this wire may also be insulated without destroying the operativeness of the battery , and in order to secure
[100 ]
the best results the wires 5 and 6 are wound side by side in each coil or layer of the windings, as clearly shown in FIG 3 of the drawings ,so that in each coil or layer of the windings
[2]
there will be alternate convolutions of the copper and iron wires forming
[5]
the voltaic couple , and it will of course be understood that there may be ant number of separate coils or layers of the wires according to the required size and capacity of the battery. Each coil or layer of the windings
[10]
is separated from the adjacent coils or layers by an interposed layer of cloth or equivalent insulating material 8 and in a similar layer of insulating material 9 also surrounds the longitudinal core-piece 1 to insulate from this core-piece
[15]
the innermost coil or layer of the windings. The terminals 10 of the copper and iron wires 5 and 6 are disconnected so as to preserve the character of the wires as the electrode of the
[20]
voltaic couple; but the other or remaining terminals of the wires are bought into contact through the interposition of any electrical instrument or device with which they may be connected to cause the electric currents
[25]
generated in the coil-body 4 to flow through such instrument or device. In the use of the battery constructed as described the same may be immersed in a cell or jar 11, containing water as the electrolyte
[30]
but it is simply necessary to have the coil-body 4 moist to excite the necessary action for the production of a current in the couple , and it is also the contemplation of the invention to place the battery in moist earth, which
[35]
alone is sufficient to provide the necessary electrolytic influence for producing an electric current. It has been found that by reason of winding the couple of copper and iron wires into a
[40]
coil-body the current traversing the windings of this body will produce a magnetic field within and around the body of sufficiently strong inductive effect for practical utilisation by means of a solenoid or secondary coil 12 as illustrated in Fig 4 of the drawings.The solenoid or
[45]
secondary coil 12 is of an ordinary construction, comprising a wire closely wound into a coil of any desired size on
[50]
an ordinary spool 13 and increased within a protective covering 14 of mica, celluliod or equivalent material. The spool 13 of the solenoid or secondary coil may be conveniently secured directly on the exterior of the
[55]
coil-body 4 between the heads 3 with a suitable layer or wrapping of insulated material 15, interposed between the spool and the body 4, and the terminals 16 of the solenoid or secondary coil may be connected up with any
[60]
instrument usually operated by a secondary currents- such for instance as a microphone-transmitter or telegraphic relay. The magnetic field produced by the current traversing the coil-body 4 induces a secondary
[65]
current in the solenoid or secondary coil 12 when the ordinary make and break of the primary current produced within the coil 4 is made between the terminals of said coil 4. It will therefore be seen that the construction of the battery illustrated in FIG 4 is practically
[70]
a self generating induction-coil, and it cab be used for every purpose that a coil of this character is used, for as long as the coil-body 4 is wet or damp with moisture electric currents will be produced in the manner
[75]
described. It will also be obvious that by reason of the magnetic inductive properties of the coil-body 4 the core-piece 1 will necessarily be magnetised while a current is going through the body 4 so that the battery
[80]
may be used as a self-generating electromagnet, if so desired, it being observed that to secure this result is simply required connecting the extended terminals of the wires 5 and 6 together after wetting or dampening
[85] the coil-body.
Many other uses of the herein-described battery will suggest themselves to those skilled in the art, and I will have it understood that any changes in the form, proportion and the
[90]
minor details of construction may be resorted to without departing from the principle or sacrificing any of the advantages of this invention.
Having thus described the invention what
[95]
is claimed and desired to be secured by letters Patent is-
1 A combined electrical battery and electomagnet, for use with water as an electrolyte ,comprising a soft -iron core-piece and a
[100]
voltaic couple of copper and iron wires insulated from each other and closely and compactly wound together in separate insulated layers wound together in separate insulated layers to produce a solid coil-body surrounding the soft-iron core-piece, substantially as
[105]
set forth.
2 An electrical battery for use with water as an electrolyte comprising a voltaic couple of insulated copper wire and bare iron wire closely wound into a coil-body substantially
[110]
as described.
3 An electrical battery for use with water as an electrolyte comprising a voltaic couple of insulated copper and bare iron wire wound side by side in separate insulated layers
[115]
to produce a coil-body, substantially as described.
4 An electrical battery ,for use with water as an electrolyte ,comprising a voltaic couple having its separate electrodes insulated from
[120]
each other and closely wound into a compact coil-body forming a self-generating primary coil when moistened and a solenoid or secondary coil fitted on the coil-body of the couple, substantially as set forth.
[125]
In testimony that I claim the foregoing as my own I have hereto affixed my signature in the presence of two witnesses.
NATHAN B STUBBLEFIELD
Witnesses
John H Siggers
W.B.Hudson
To:
energy2000@yahoogroups.comSubject: Re: [energy2000 / energy 21) earth battery
This a collections of emails taken from our energy 2000 newsgroups concerning Earth batteries several members forwarded this information to the group
Again this is nothing new. Poor soil conditions result in a
Difference
Of potential. This is why in communications one has to run ground tests.
Also another reason some places has to put in a ground field.
Well differences in metals can create power just like anything. Gold of
Course is a better conductor then lead. But copper is the cheapest middle
ground or best bang for the buck. Putting one zinc and the other nickel
isn’t going to help. You can get a nice fluke meter.. Get 2 grounding
rods. Connect them via 2 wires. Walk around the land and take readings
after pounding them in. this will tell you what tell difference in
potential is. The larger the difference the larger the amount of power
produced. The more rods in the ground tied together the less of a
potential since you will be equalizing the potential. And remember as it
rains or the ground gets moisture the less of a potential will be in
existence sense the water will also act as a conductor and equalizer
It’s fully possible, but think carefully of which metals you put in the ground. You don’t want to get the wrong metal salts in the ground, because the land can quite fast become unusable if you get the wrong salts in the ground.
Hi earth battery enthusiast. I have a small E battery in the yard. Copper tube and zinc rod. I’m not convinced that this is not a chemical reaction. The voltage is unstable. Zinc is hard to come by. I understand you can get this working well with copper and aluminum. Does anyone know of a good configuration that will produce one amp or so? I would like to test for electrolysis and try to use the energy. I have yet to hear from someone that is making use of this power source.
-------------------------------end of email---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
You’ll find out that earth batteries work in a very different way that typical chemical reaction. When I began my testing (using dissimilar metals) I decided to separate the plates, zinc & copper, by a distance of Thirty-two feet. The soil was BONE DRY as we were in a drought. The plates worked equally well whether placed next to each other and wetted or thirty two feet apart in BONE DRY earth.
They will also work if made from similar plate material. Thirty two feet is far too distant to maintain ion stripping as in a standard chemical battery. This is generally how I know whether or not someone is talking "hands on" or "blowing smoke". You certainly CAN cause a chemical reaction with moist earth and dissimilar plates, but the Earth Battery effect transcends standard chemical ion stripping theories.
Try your own experiments and you’ll see!
-------------------------------end of email---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
So what you are saying is wet earth and good soil and poor soil and dry will work the same? We have done studies and have seen that good soil has a very low difference of potential. Poor soil can have a higher difference of potential.
Now what I would like to see is some data. What materials were used? What is the soil conditions and makeup. What output is produced and at what load.
Workings in the communications where one can see 100amps at 50 volts go through a bad return we have to ensure we have good ground. The only way of doing this is a grounding test in the location we are working. Also any measurable amount of potential difference can cause errors in the data transmissions. We have had to put in 20 grounding rods in a grounding field to create a decent return but I will say there was never enough difference to produce any meaningful power.
Blowing smoke? Not me. My life my co-workers life as well as your data is in my hands when we put in a new office.
You’ll find out that earth batteries work in a very different way that typical chemical reaction. When I began my testing (using dissimilar metals) I decided to separate the plates, zinc & copper, by a distance of Thirty-two feet. The soil was BONE DRY as we were in a drought. The plates worked equally well whether placed next to each other and wetted or thirty two feet apart in BONE DRY earth.
They will also work if made from similar plate material. Thirty two feet is far too distant to maintain ion stripping as in a standard chemical battery. This is generally how I know whether or not someone is talking "hands on" or "blowing smoke". You certainly CAN cause a chemical reaction with moist earth and dissimilar plates, but the Earth Battery effect transcends standard chemical ion stripping theories.
-------------------------------end of email---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
No offence taken. My meters I use is a fluke 87III calibrated 2times a year. But installers use a much nicer and more sensitive meters. The soil that we have had to put in the 20 posts where very loamy soil. Difference of potential was very high for communications work. We have had to go in 6 months after install and increase a ground field due to the soil drying out causing hits on transmissions equipment. I do have good soil for this to take place as I have loamy soil and poor ground. If I can get this kind of output this will more than handle my server and PC equipment in the house as a backup. Right now I have 10 60aH gell cells I use for ups and I think this could more then easily keep these batteries topped up and charge if I loose power. Since I have plenty of ground rods I can put in a system relatively easy. How do you install the plates?? And what design are they? Are they flat plate? What size?
-------------------------------end of email---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
So what you are saying is wet earth and good soil and poor soil and dry will work the same?
Yes, in my experience I’ve found negligible differences.
We have done studies and have seen that good soil has a very low difference of potential. Poor soil can have a higher difference of potential.
This has not occurred in ANY of my experiments! What is the geological nature of the "poor soil" you speak of?
Now what I would like to see is some data. What materials were used?
What is the soil conditions and makeup. What output is produced and at
what load.
Go back thru my comments. Output produced is 15v @ 9 amps. Load is 8 6v 235ah battery bank & 8 12v 325ah battery bank. I am aware of a government published result of 53v @ 56amps, though I’ve not tried that as it would cook my batteries. I utilize my meager experimental budget for practical items.
Workings in the communications where one can see 100amps at 50 volts go
through a bad return we have to ensure we have good ground. The only way of doing this is a grounding test in the location we are working.
Also any measurable amount of potential difference can cause errors in
the data transmissions. We have had to put in 20 grounding rods in a grounding field to create a decent return but I will say there was never enough difference to produce any meaningful power.
Hmmm, if you measure the potential from one end of a bridge to the other, my experience shows a MINIMUM voltage of 200 and a usable amperage of 190! In your discipline you should be able to modify your testing equipment to prove this for you. VERY long leads! I’ve tested several bridges and they are simply Giant earth batteries!
Blowing smoke? Not me. My life my co-workers life as well as your data
is in my hands when we put in a new office.
I’d not pointed fingers and did not intend to offend you! I was actually not speaking of anyone on the list. I believe that my soil is pretty well balanced, though it does have a lot of granite/silicon. This leads me to believe the phenomena is grounded (pardon the pun) in the EB simply being a collector. I’m sure you’re aware of the ground radio effect and I think that this is why the EB works with similar plates as well as dissimilar. This would also explain the distance between the plates not having an effect. We all know the effects of electricity on semi conducting materials and the granite and silicon, though impure in nature, still conduct the energy that it’s exposed to.
-------------------------------end of email---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
,
You’ll find out that earth batteries work in a very different way that
typical chemical reaction. When I began my testing (using dissimilar metals) I decided to separate the plates, zinc & copper, by a distance of thirty-two feet. The soil was BONE DRY as we were in a drought. The plates worked equally well whether placed next to each other and wetted or thirty-two feet apart in BONE DRY earth.
They will also work if made from similar plate material. Thirty two feet is far too distant to maintain ion stripping as in a standard chemical battery. This is generally how I know whether or not someone is talking "hands on" or "blowing smoke". You certainly CAN cause a chemical reaction with moist earth and dissimilar plates, but the Earth Battery effect transcends standard chemical ion stripping theories.
Try your own experiments and you’ll see!
-------------------------------end of email---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Again this is nothing new. Poor soil conditions result in a difference of potential. This is why in communications one has to run ground tests. Also another reason some places has to put in a ground field.
-------------------------------end of email---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I wonder if depending on your soil if two dissimilar materials can be
put in the soil and the chemical reaction between the two would
produce a small voltage? But can enough be made to be useful if this
is possible.
So what you are saying is wet earth and good soil and poor soil and dry will work the same?
Yes, in my experience I’ve found negligible differences.
We have done studies and have seen that good soil has a very low difference of potential. Poor soil can have a higher difference of potential.
This has not occurred in ANY of my experiments! What is the geological nature of the "poor soil" you speak of?
Now what I would like to see is some data. What materials were used? What is the soil conditions and makeup. What output is produced and at what load.
Go back thru my comments. Output produced is 15v @ 9 amps. Load is 8 6v 235ah battery bank & 8 12v 325ah battery bank. I am aware of a government published result of 53v @ 56amps, though I’ve not tried that as it would cook my batteries. I utilize my meager experimental budget for practical items.
Workings in the communications where one can see 100amps at 50 volts go through a bad return we have to ensure we have good ground. The only way of doing this is a grounding test in the location we are working. Also any measurable amount of potential difference can cause errors in the data transmissions. We have had to put in 20 grounding rods in a grounding field to create a decent return but I will say there was never enough difference to produce any meaningful power.
Hmmm, if you measure the potential from one end of a bridge to the other, my experience shows a MINIMUM voltage of 200 and a usable amperage of 190! In your discipline you should be able to modify your testing equipment to prove this for yourself. VERY long leads! I’ve tested several bridges and they are simply Giant earth batteries!
Blowing smoke? Not me. My life my co-workers life as well as your data is in my hands when we put in a new office.
I’d not pointed fingers and did not intend to offend you! I was actually not speaking of anyone on the list.
I believe that my soil is pretty well balanced, though it does have a lot of granite/silicon. This leads me to believe the phenomena is grounded (pardon the pun) in the EB simply being a collector. I’m sure you’re aware of the ground radio effect and I think that this is why the EB works with similar plates as well as dissimilar. This would also explain the distance between the plates not have an effect. We all know the effects of electricity on semi conducting materials and the granite and silicon, though impure in nature, still conduct the energy that it’s exposed to.
-------------------------------end of email---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
You’ll find out that earth batteries work in a very different way that typical chemical reaction. When I began my testing (using dissimilar metals) I decided to separate the plates, zinc & copper, by a distance of thirty-two feet. The soil was BONE DRY as we were in a drought. The plates worked equally well whether placed next to each other and wetted or thirty-two feet apart in BONE DRY earth.
They will also work if made from similar plate material. Thirty two feet is far too distant to maintain ion stripping as in a standard chemical battery. This is generally how I know whether or not someone is talking "hands on" or "blowing smoke". You certainly CAN cause a chemical reaction with moist earth and dissimilar plates, but the Earth Battery effect transcends standard chemical ion stripping theories.
Try your own experiments and you’ll see!
-------------------------------end of email---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Again this is nothing new. Poor soil conditions result in a difference of potential. This is why in communications one has to run ground tests.
Also another reason some places has to put in a ground field.
I wonder if depending on your soil if two dissimilar materials can be put in the soil and the chemical reaction between the two would produce a small voltage? But can enough be made to be useful if this is possible.
-------------------------------end of email---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The plates I normally use are just flat plates. I have an array that utilizes a "V" style corrugation but that was to conserve space. My most successful set uses an "H" configuration where two pairs of plates are on either side or one horizontal in between them. That is the configuration I use most often now, though I don’t know how they work in loamy soil. I just make sure they’re buried at least 18 inches. I’ve learned a lot since I first wrote the booklet and haven’t had time to update the info.
Modify some leads for that Fluke and take it to a bridge for kicks. I actually burned a loading coil but it got real bright before it separated! The coil was simply bailing wire (or re-bar tie wire in the city) 20ft long wrapped around a mop handle. Each turn was separated about 1 inch from the next. The whole coil was only a couple of feet long and I tested it @ 100 amps. It got hot, but worked well. When I used it on the bridge, it got hot, got bright and burned in half.
At first I thought is was some sort of galvanic phenomena, but all the supporting material is made of the same metal. (iron) This eliminated the dissimilar chemical issues and made me really start into the EB research hot and heavy.
-------------------------------end of email---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
No offence taken. My meters I use is a fluke 87III calibrated 2times a year. But installers use a much nicer and more sensitive meters. The soil that we have had to put in the 20 posts where very loamy soil. Difference of potential was very high for communications work. We have had to go in 6 months after install and increase a ground field due to the soil drying out causing hits on transmissions equipment. I do have good soil for this to take place as I have loamy soil and poor ground. If I can get this kind of output this wills more then handle my server and PC equipment in the house as a backup. Right now I have 10 60aH ell cells I use for ups and I think this could more then easily keep these batteries topped up and charge if I loose power. Since I have plenty of ground rods I can put in a system relatively easy. How do you install the plates?? And what design are they? Are they flat plate? What size?
-------------------------------end of email---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
So what you are saying is wet earth and good soil and poor soil and dry will work the same?
Yes, in my experience I’ve found negligible differences.
We have done studies and have seen that good soil has a very low difference of potential. Poor soil can have a higher difference of potential.
This has not occurred in ANY of my experiments! What is the geological nature of the "poor soil" you speak of?
Now what I would like to see is some data. What materials were used?
What is the soil conditions and makeup. What output is produced and at
what load.
Go back thru my comments. Output produced is 15v @ 9 amps. Load is 8 6v 235ah battery bank & 8 12v 325ah battery bank. I am aware of a government published result of 53v @ 56amps, though I’ve not tried that as it would cook my batteries. I utilize my meager experimental budget for practical items.
Workings in the communications where one can see 100amps at 50 volts go
through a bad return we have to ensure we have good ground. The only way of doing this is a grounding test in the location we are working.
Also any measurable amount of potential difference can cause errors in
the data transmissions. We have had to put in 20 grounding rods in a grounding field to create a decent return but I will say there was never enough difference to produce any meaningful power.
Hmmm, if you measure the potential from one end of a bridge to the other, my experience shows a MINIMUM voltage of 200 and a usable amperage of 190! In your discipline you should be able to modify your testing equipment to prove this for you. VERY long leads! I’ve tested several bridges and they are simply Giant earth batteries!
Blowing smoke? Not me. My life my co-workers life as well as your data
is in my hands when we put in a new office.
I’d not pointed fingers and did not intend to offend you! I was actually not speaking of anyone on the list. I believe that my soil is pretty well balanced, though it does have allot of granite/silicon. This leads me to believe the phenomena is grounded (pardon the pun) in the EB simply being a collector. I’m sure you’re aware of the ground radio effect and I think that this is why the EB works with similar plates as well as dissimilar. This would also explain the distance between the plates not having an effect. We all know the effects of electricity on semi conducting materials and the granite and silicon, though impure in nature, still conduct the energy that it’s exposed to.
-------------------------------end of email---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
You’ll find out that earth batteries work in a very different way that
typical chemical reaction. When I began my testing (using dissimilar metals) I decided to separate the plates, zinc & copper, by a distance of thirty-two feet. The soil was BONE DRY as we were in a drought. The plates worked equally well whether placed next to each other and wetted or thirty-two feet apart in BONE DRY earth.
They will also work if made from similar plate material. Thirty two feet is far too distant to maintain ion stripping as in a standard chemical battery. This is generally how I know whether or not someone is talking "hands on" or "blowing smoke". You certainly CAN cause a chemical reaction with moist earth and dissimilar plates, but the Earth Battery effect transcends standard chemical ion stripping theories.
Try your own experiments and you’ll see!
-------------------------------end of email---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
You’ll find out that earth batteries work in a very different way
that
typical chemical reaction. When I began my testing (using dissimilar
metals) I decided to separate the plates, zinc & copper, by a
distance of
Thirty-two feet. The soil was BONE DRY as we were in a drought. The plates worked equally well whether placed next to each other and wetted or thirty two feet apart in BONE DRY earth.
I guess the bottom line does it have any practical use? can enough power is gained to light an LED for example.
Now another idea can all those radio waves (and all those watts
radiated) in the air be gathered by an antenna and put to use?
-------------------------------end of email---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
If I can get this kind of output this will more then handle my server and PC equipment in the house as a backup. Right now I have 10 60aH gell cells I use for ups and I think this could more then easily keep these batteries topped up and charge if I loose power. Since I have plenty of ground rods I can put in a system relatively easy. How do you install the plates?? And what design are they? Are they flat plate? What size?
Hasn’t it been found out that buried horizontal ground rods are more effective than vertical. This is how I run my Ham setup.
Also if dealing with transmitted power horizontal rods matching part of the wave length you are using and the more of them you have the more effective your signal output. but there comes a point of diminishing returns. OF course maybe we are looking at different things here.
when you put in a ground, what is the
sop for testing it???
methods and results?
Please note this is not for any argument I’m just
wondering what you use to determine a "good
ground"
-------------------------------end of email---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
So what you are saying is wet earth and good
soil and poor soil and dry
will work the same? We have done studies and
have seen that good soil
has a very low difference of potential. Poor
soil can have a higher
difference of potential.
Now what I would like to see is some data. What
materials were used?
What is the soil conditions and makeup. What
output is produced and at
what load.
Working in the communications where one can see
100amps at 50 volts go
through a bad return we have to ensure we have
good ground. The only way
of doing this is a grounding test in the
location we are working. Also
any measurable amount of potential difference
can cause errors in the
data transmissions. We have had to put in 20
grounding rods in a
grounding field to create a decent return but I
will say there was never
enough difference to produce any meaningful
power.
Blowing smoke? Not me. My life my co-workers
life as well as your data
is in my hands when we put in a new office.
-------------------------------end of email---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
When I began my
testing (using dissimilar
metals) I decided to separate the plates, zinc
& copper, by a distance
of thirty-two feet. The soil was BONE DRY as
we were in a drought. The
plates worked equally well whether placed next
to each other and wetted
or thirty-two feet apart in BONE DRY earth.
They will also work if made from similar plate
material. Thirty two
feet is far too distant to maintain ion
stripping as in a standard
chemical battery. This is generally how I know
whether or not someone is
talking "hands on" or "blowing smoke". You
certainly CAN cause a
chemical reaction with moist earth and
dissimilar plates, but the Earth
Battery effect transcends standard chemical ion
stripping theories.
Try your own experiments and you’ll see!
-------------------------------end of email---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Again this is nothing new. Poor soil
conditions result in a
difference of potential. This is why in
communications one has to
run ground tests.
Also another reason some places has to put
in a ground field.
Can you share the size and material of the plates you use. I looked for this in previous post and seemed to have mist this.
Thanks,
-------------------------------end of email---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The plates I normally use are just flat plates. I have an array that utilizes a "V" style corrugation but that was to conserve space. My most successful set uses an "H" configuration where two pairs of plates are on either side and one horizontal in between them. That is the configuration I use most often now, though I don’t know how they work in loamy soil. I just make sure they’re buried at least 18 inches. I’ve learned a lot since I first wrote the booklet and haven’t had time to update the info.
Modify some leads for that Fluke and take it to a bridge for kicks. I actually burned a loading coil but it got real bright before it separated! The coil was simply bailing wire (or re-bar tie wire in the city) 20ft long wrapped around a mop handle. Each turn was separated about 1 inch from the next. The whole coil was only a couple of feet long and I tested it @ 100 amps. It got hot, but worked well. When I used it on the bridge, it got hot, got bright and burned in half.
At first I thought is was some sort of galvanic phenomena, but all the supporting material is made of the same metal. (iron) This eliminated the dissimilar chemical issue and made me really start into the EB research hot and heavy.
-------------------------------end of email---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
No offence taken. My meters I use is a fluke 87III calibrated 2times a year. But installers use a much nicer and more sensitive meters. The soil that we have had to put in the 20 posts where very loamy soil. Difference of potential was very high for communications work. We have had to go in 6 months after install and increase a ground field due to the soil drying out causing hits on transmissions equipment. I do have good soil for this to take place as I have loamy soil and poor ground. If I can get this kind of output this will more then handle my server and PC equipment in the house as a backup. Right now I have 10 60aH gell cells I use for ups and I think this could more then easily keep these batteries topped up and charge if I loose power. Since I have plenty of ground rods I can put in a system relatively easy. How do you install the plates?? And what design are they? Are they flat plate? What size?
So what you are saying is wet earth and good soil and poor soil and dry will work the same?
Yes, in my experience I’ve found negligible differences.
We have done studies and have seen that good soil has a very low difference of potential. Poor soil can have a higher difference of potential.
This has not occurred in ANY of my experiments! What is the geological nature of the "poor soil" you speak of?
Now what I would like to see is some data. What materials were used?
What is the soil conditions and makeup. What output is produced and at
what load.
Go back thru my comments. Output produced is 15v @ 9 amps. Load is 8 6v 235ah battery bank & 8 12v 325ah battery bank. I am aware of a government published result of 53v @ 56amps, though I’ve not tried that as it would cook my batteries. I utilize my meager experimental budget for practical items.
Working in the communications where one can see 100amps at 50 volts go
through a bad return we have to ensure we have good ground. The only way of doing this is a grounding test in the location we are working.
Also any measurable amount of potential difference can cause errors in
the data transmissions. We have had to put in 20 grounding rods in a grounding field to create a decent return but I will say there was never enough difference to produce any meaningful power.
Hmmm, if you measure the potential from one end of a bridge to the other, my experience shows a MINIMUM voltage of 200 and a usable amperage of 190! In your discipline you should be able to modify your testing equipment to prove this for yourself. VERY long leads! I’ve tested several bridges and they are simply Giant earth batteries!
Blowing smoke? Not me. My life my co-workers life as well as your data
is in my hands when we put in a new office.
I’d not pointed fingers and did not intend to offend you! I was actually not speaking of anyone on the list. I believe that my soil is pretty well balanced, though it does have a lot of granite/silicon. This leads me to believe the phenomena is grounded (pardon the pun) in the EB simply being a collector. I’m sure you’re aware of the ground radio effect and I think that this is why the EB works with similar plates as well as dissimilar. This would also explain the distance between the plates not having an effect. We all know the effects of electricity on semi conducting materials and the granite and silicon, though impure in nature, still conduct the energy that it’s exposed to.
-------------------------------end of email---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
You’ll find out that earth batteries work in a very different way that
typical chemical reaction. When I began my testing (using dissimilar metals) I decided to separate the plates, zinc & copper, by a distance of thirty-two feet. The soil was BONE DRY as we were in a drought. The plates worked equally well whether placed next to each other and wetted or thirty-two feet apart in BONE DRY earth.
They will also work if made from similar plate material. Thirty two feet is far too distant to maintain ion stripping as in a standard chemical battery. This is generally how I know whether or not someone is talking "hands on" or "blowing smoke". You certainly CAN cause a chemical reaction with moist earth and dissimilar plates, but the Earth Battery effect transcends standard chemical ion stripping theories.
Try your own experiments and you’ll see!
-------------------------------end of email---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Again this is nothing new. Poor soil conditions result in a
difference of potential. This is why in communications one has to
run ground tests. Also another reason some places has to put in a
,
my plates range from 2x2 feet to standard 4x8-sheet stock. The larger the surface area, the larger the output. Pretty simple really. I believe that the plates act as collectors similar to an antenna and as one who was a radio nut in my younger days, I have a pretty good grasp of radio/electronics theory. Hope that helps.
Can you share the size and material of the plates you use. I looked for this in previous post and seemed to have mist this.
Thanks,
-------------------------------end of email---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The plates I normally use are just flat plates. I have an array that utilizes a "V" style corrugation but that was to conserve space. My most successful set uses an "H" configuration where two pairs of plates are on either side and one horizontal in between them. That is the configuration I use most often now, though I don’t know how they work in loamy soil. I just make sure they’re buried at least 18 inches. I’ve learned a lot since I first wrote the booklet and haven’t had time to update the info.
Modify some leads for that Fluke and take it to a bridge for kicks. I actually burned a loading coil but it got real bright before it separated! The coil was simply bailing wire (or re-bar tie wire in the city) 20ft long wrapped around a mop handle. Each turn was separated about 1 inch from the next. The whole coil was only a couple of feet long and I tested it @ 100 amps. It got hot, but worked well. When I used it on the bridge, it got hot, got bright and burned in half.
At first I thought is was some sort of galvanic phenomena, but all the
supporting material is made of the same metal. (iron) This eliminated the
dissimilar chemical issue and made me really start into the EB research
hot
and heavy.
----- Original Message -----
-------------------------------end of email---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
No offence taken. My meters I use is a fluke 87III calibrated 2times a year. But installers use a much nicer and more sensitive meters. The soil that we have had to put in the 20 posts where very loamy soil. Difference of potential was very high for communications work. We have had to go in 6 months after install and increase a ground field due to the soil drying out causing hits on transmissions equipment. I do have good soil for this to take place as I have loamy soil and poor ground. If I can get this kind of output this will more then handle my server and PC equipment in the house as a backup. Right now I have 10 60aH gell cells I use for ups and I think this could more then easily keep these batteries topped up and charge if I loose power. Since I have plenty of ground rods I can put in a system relatively easy. How do you install the plates?? And what design are they? Are they flat plate? What size?
-------------------------------end of email---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
So what you are saying is wet earth and good soil and poor soil and dry will work the same?
Yes, in my experience I’ve found negligible differences.
We have done studies and have seen that good soil
has a very low difference of potential. Poor soil can have a higher difference of potential.
This has not occurred in ANY of my experiments! What is the geological nature of the "poor soil" you speak of?
Now what I would like to see is some data. What materials were used?
What is the soil conditions and makeup. What output is produced and at
what load.
Go back thru my comments. Output produced is 15v @ 9 amps. Load is 8 6v 235ah battery bank & 8 12v 325ah battery bank. I am aware of a government published result of 53v @ 56amps, though I’ve not tried that as it would cook my batteries. I utilize my meager experimental budget for practical items.
Working in the communications where one can see 100amps at 50 volts go
through a bad return we have to ensure we have good ground. The only way of doing this is a grounding test in the location we are working.
Also any measurable amount of potential difference can cause errors in
the data transmissions. We have had to put in 20 grounding rods in a grounding field to create a decent return but I will say there was never enough difference to produce any meaningful power.
Hmmm, if you measure the potential from one end of a bridge to the other, my experience shows a MINIMUM voltage of 200 and a usable amperage of 190! In your discipline you should be able to modify your testing equipment to prove this for yourself. VERY long leads! I’ve tested several bridges and they are simply Giant earth batteries!
Blowing smoke? Not me. My life my co-workers life as well as your data
is in my hands when we put in a new office.
I’d not pointed fingers and did not intend to offend you! I was actually not speaking of anyone on the list. I believe that my soil is pretty well balanced, though it does have a lot of granite/silicon. This leads me to believe the phenomena is grounded (pardon the pun) in the EB simply being a collector. I’m sure you’re aware of the ground radio effect and I think that this is why the EB works with similar plates as well as dissimilar. This would also explain the distance between the plates not having an effect. We all know the effects of electricity on semi conducting materials and the granite and silicon, though impure in nature, still conduct the energy that it’s exposed to.
-------------------------------end of email---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
You’ll find out that earth batteries work in a very different way that
typical chemical reaction. When I began my testing (using dissimilar metals) I decided to separate the plates, zinc & copper, by a distance of thirty-two feet. The soil was BONE DRY as we were in a drought. The plates worked equally well whether placed next to each other and wetted or thirty-two feet apart in BONE DRY earth.
They will also work if made from similar plate material. Thirty two feet is far too distant to maintain ion stripping as in a standard chemical battery. This is generally how I know whether or not someone is talking "hands on" or "blowing smoke". You certainly CAN cause a chemical reaction with moist earth and dissimilar plates, but the Earth Battery effect transcends standard chemical ion stripping theories.
Try your own experiments and you’ll see!
-------------------------------end of email---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Again this is nothing new. Poor soil conditions result in a difference of potential. This is why in communications one has to run ground tests. Also another reason some places has to put in a ground field.
I wonder if depending on your soil if two dissimilar materials can be
put in the soil and the chemical reaction between the two would
produce a small voltage? But can enough be made to be useful if this
is possible.
-------------------------------end of email---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes horizontal grounds can work better then straight but it becomes unstable. With the grounding rods vertical you have better balance due to the inconsistencies of soil.
-------------------------------end of email---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
If I can get this kind of output this will more then handle my server and PC equipment in the house as a backup. Right now I have 10 60aH gell cells I use for ups and I think this could more then easily keep these batts topped up and charge if I loose power. Since I have plenty of ground rods I can put in a system relatively easy. How do you install the plates?? And what design are they? Are they flat plate? What size?
-------------------------------end of email---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hasn’t it been found out that buried horizontal ground rods are more effective than vertical. This is how I run my Ham setup. Also if dealing with transmitted power horizontal rods matching part of the wave length you are using and the more of them you have the more effective your signal output. but there comes a point of diminishing returns. OF course maybe we are looking at different things here.
-------------------------------end of email---------------------------------------------------------------------------------